PORTALS! [update: 100% smooth, v0.12_alpha]

A place to show off your latest screenshots and for people to comment on them. Only start a new thread here if you have some nice images to show off!
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nullsquared
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Post by nullsquared »

Praetor wrote:How viable is it to not create this as an entire engine, but instead as a library which can hook into engines? It might be a pain to abstract out things like which physics engine is used, so maybe it isn't worth it at first.
Not going to happen, at all. Everything is heavily dependent (not that that's a bad thing). Besides, I'm working on my own engine and game here. This isn't a "try to make portals" project. It is merely a sub-system to the whole engine :D

- NewtonGD is the best choice for this since it used C-style callbacks for everything. A normal "here, on each update just use getPosition() to put your graphics object at the right spot" type of engine is not going to work.

- my whole framework of physics is based directly upon Newton and directly upon portals (... and, *cough* other physical confusions I'm not going to talk about here ;))

- due to the portals, the rendering order and loop is heavily dependent. I'm skipping the whole renderOneFrame()/FrameListener idea. I'm also skipping the whole windowRT->update() idea. I render the main scene manually, then each portal manually. The stencil buffer should not be messed with during some parts, either.

- many other things that I'm not going into-depth here

Basically, portals aren't a plug-n-play type of thing, to put it simply. That's why it took Portal a year or two, even though the whole game engine and everything was complete.

On another note, I've lots of updates. Going to upload a video and put it on the first post shortly.
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Noman
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Post by Noman »

Wow. loved the floating cubes at the end.
About the in-pluggable part, I dunno.

Are you planning to release sources anytime? If so, I would definitely try to see if its possible to somehow fit portals as a more ogre-friendly project...
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Post by nullsquared »

Noman wrote:Wow. loved the floating cubes at the end.
About the in-pluggable part, I dunno.

Are you planning to release sources anytime? If so, I would definitely try to see if its possible to somehow fit portals as a more ogre-friendly project...
Thanks :D

This is as Ogre-friendly as it'll get with stencil portals. RT portals (can't be correctly recursive, take loads of vram, cannot be anti-aliased, etc) fit more nicely with a simple portalRT->update() method. But you lose all the benefits of stencil portals. Which need manual rendering to the depth buffer, ignoring of the colour buffer 90% of the time, usage of the stencil buffer, and some manual rendering of certain things directly to the stencil buffer (depth write off, depth check on, colour write off), and a bunch of other stuff.

I was thinking of releasing the source (I was going to make this open-source), but now I'm debating it. Maybe more towards the end of the project, where stuff is really accomplished.
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CaseyB
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Post by CaseyB »

This is AWESOME! I can't wait to get a chance to pay with it!!! I really liked the part where the portal was floating in the air and you could only see it from the front. What happens if you walk through the back of it?
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Post by nullsquared »

CaseyB wrote:This is AWESOME! I can't wait to get a chance to pay with it!!! I really liked the part where the portal was floating in the air and you could only see it from the front. What happens if you walk through the back of it?
:D

Nothing happens if you walk through the back of it. Hm. You really can't walk through the back of it - there is no back to it :D (the idea of that scene was to show that portals aren't restricted to walls, and they do not alter geometry like the Portal portals - stuff indeed goes through a "hole" and does not interact with whatever is behind that "hole", because... well, it's *in* the hole ;))

EDIT: BTW, you may see a little "popping" or "jerkiness" when going through a portal. That's not actual jerkiness, it's just that the head is getting transported after the main body of the player (and you're a seeing quick black flash of the background)... that is, I need to create a better stencil model, that's all ;)
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Post by CaseyB »

agi_shi wrote:Nothing happens if you walk through the back of it. Hm. You really can't walk through the back of it - there is no back to it :D
That's perfect!! That's exactly what I hoped you would say!
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Post by jorrit5477 »

Looks really good, and I agree with Casey on the portal just in the middle of the room. Lends itself for some experimental gameplay :)
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Post by Aladrin »

All I can say is: Hurry up with the game!

You've done an amazing amount of work so far on this. My impression of Narbacular drop was that it took them quite a while to get it working, and you've done it really quickly. I can't wait to see what more you add to this.
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Post by nikki »

How viable is it to not create this as an entire engine, but instead as a library which can hook into engines? It might be a pain to abstract out things like which physics engine is used, so maybe it isn't worth it at first.
Library? But, I don't think many people are going to include portals in their games just like that. It isn't like sound effects or shaders or something. Its a complete gameplay feature. It depends on the idea behind a game. I don't think the maker of a pool game would use it. I don't even think it should be a feature of every FPS game.

Imagine there's a guy working on a chess game. Suddenly he says, "Hey look! There's a Valve Portal type library over here! Awesome! I can add it to my chess game!". That'd be funny. :)

We don't want to see a thousand more games based on portals do we? What made portals so cool was that its new. Including it in every game will decrease its coolness.

Ignore my post if that's not what you meant. :)
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Post by Aquatix »

Amazing update, as always :wink: ! The floating thing was fun indeed!
Imagine there's a guy working on a chess game. Suddenly he says, "Hey look! There's a Valve Portal type library over here! Awesome! I can add it to my chess game!". That'd be funny.
Can't wait to see a chess game with portals. Say, instead of a E2-E4, you can do E2-open portal- E8 - kill the king :twisted: !

Just my 2 cent about plugins: doubt this would or should ever be possible. This is kind of like D&D system at its time - it was an entire idea, not just a feature. Yes, you can license it, but it should be in its entire engine, and not a subsystem of something.
As far as the "coolness" goes - well, I agree the way we see portals now is its a fun new toy, which wasn't around before, but it shouldn't be, that only few games are entitle to use this system. There is no need to make an entire game using portals (like Portal or Prey), but instead it can very well be nicely integrated into a bigger project, say any RPG, RTS (not sure about FPS, maybe only Unreal Tournament, or other arena-style games might benefit) can use it only in those scenes, where there is a portal according to the story-line (for those who remember HoMM IV, there was a plot where a whole planet gets *BOOM* and ppl run to the portals. if they had this tech, then it could be a really pleasant experience seeing "realistic" portals).
The mistery of Yoda's speech uncovered is:
Just an old Forth programmer Yoda was. :)

Nulle rule sine exceptione (lat.)
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Post by nullsquared »

Update (v0.07) [first page].
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Post by nullsquared »

(bump) Update [v0.09]. Check the front page. Extremely smooth portal transitions for the player and objects.
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Post by ajs15822 »

Weeee, that's awesome-- great job agi_shi. 8)
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Post by nullsquared »

ajs15822 wrote:Weeee, that's awesome-- great job agi_shi. 8)
Thanks :D

(btw, sorry for the crappy quality)
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Post by nullsquared »

ajs15822 wrote:Weeee, that's awesome-- great job agi_shi. 8)
Thanks :D

(btw, sorry for the crappy quality video, YouTube wasn't cooperating with me :()
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Post by nullsquared »

Sorry for another bump, but I'd like to announce version 0.12 alpha! Check the first page ;)
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