Why OGRE is Dying

Anything and everything that's related to OGRE or the wider graphics field that doesn't fit into the other forums.
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Kojack
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Re: Why ORGE is Dying

Post by Kojack » Tue Oct 01, 2019 4:44 am

dark_sylinc wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:24 am
When it comes to building the engine, we recently added quick start build scripts for 2.1 & 2.2 to handle that step in a few clicks.
...
I hope the quick start build scripts help you with that!
I tried them out today, they work pretty well. Although I ended up spending something like an hour stepping through the code because every sample failed because the d3d11 renderer couldn't be loaded due to the module not being found, despite the renderer being there.
Turns out it was because the build script didn't copy the amd_ags_x64.dll library into the bin directories. Damn windows error message just said module not found, it doesn't say which module, and ogre only knew the renderer wasn't loading.
I copied the lib and it all works now.

Otherwise, far easier than it was.
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xrgo
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Re: Why OGRE is Dying

Post by xrgo » Tue Oct 01, 2019 12:16 pm

I also just tested the build script, worked at first try, but also had to copy the amd_ags_x64.dll file by hand to run the samples
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hydexon
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Re: Why OGRE is Dying

Post by hydexon » Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:28 am

Since was a loong time i've posted here, i want to post my thoughts.

Many people as well newcomers, they mistake OGRE as an fully-fledged game engine instead of an rendering engine, this is because many blog posts, forums across the internet treats them as game engines (Google is one of them when you type "game engines" and Wikipedia as well).

Also i've loved the progress of OGRE 2.x series, but the legacy codebase 1.x cripples them too much to being adopted as modern rendering engine, for example the extreme dependence to the ResourceManager which many find as obstacle, like me which i've wrote an asynchronous asset loading/processing system, but i had to discard it because the OGRE resource manager doesn't like multithreading.

Many of them is moving to other rendering engines which supports the newer APIs (DX12/Vulkan) and are much more lightweight and non-intrusive: bgfx, DiligentEngine, TheForge (this is an kind-of exception since their build system is quirky and messy, but they even support game consoles such XboxOne, PS4, and Nintendo Switch upon request).

Despite i've liked the OGRE's new improvements, my engine architecture was not compatible to OGRE,since used raw Vulkan to test multithreaded environments.

My two cents.
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longer
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Re: Why OGRE is Dying

Post by longer » Tue Oct 29, 2019 7:12 am

OGRE not dying but survive difficult.
OGRE is only a rendering library. Just a toolset. This decision is successful but painfully.

Mobile platform is a big opportunity, But OGRE 2.x does not support well.

I think OGRE lacks a common component across platforms:
```
0. Vulkan (API) for mobile platform is Urgent.
1. Unified file system, like cocos2d. At IOS and Android have same interface.
2. OS System event, like touchs event, I think ois is not a good choice. We need native solution.
3. Embedding OGRE into Android ios need more easier, The launch process of OGRE is too vague,
Especially RanderTarget mapper to Android SurfaceView, IOS UIWindow UIView.
4. CMake is good, but A specific compilable project is so important. Many newbies are confused here.
In addition, when I use ogre, I manually re-do all project for the dependencies and ogre itself,
so my partners will not get lost in CMake.
5. Resource format export tool, mesh material etc. The blender2ogre is good, but not Official. not stable.
Resources are more difficult to produce.
6. UI Library, MyGUI CEGUI recent update seems to be slowing, which makes me very worried.
Once the downstream ecosystem of the rendering engine stops, it brings the loss of users.
```

Cross-platform out of the box is very attractive.

This is my build system in a specific environment, which can be compiled directly and completely.
https://bitbucket.org/mm_longcheng/mm_lib
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paroj
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Re: Why OGRE is Dying

Post by paroj » Tue Oct 29, 2019 1:21 pm

longer wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 7:12 am
OGRE not dying but survive difficult.
OGRE is only a rendering library. Just a toolset. This decision is successful but painfully.

Mobile platform is a big opportunity, But OGRE 2.x does not support well.

I think OGRE lacks a common component across platforms:
```
0. Vulkan (API) for mobile platform is Urgent.
1. Unified file system, like cocos2d. At IOS and Android have same interface.
2. OS System event, like touchs event, I think ois is not a good choice. We need native solution.
3. Embedding OGRE into Android ios need more easier, The launch process of OGRE is too vague,
Especially RanderTarget mapper to Android SurfaceView, IOS UIWindow UIView.
4. CMake is good, but A specific compilable project is so important. Many newbies are confused here.
In addition, when I use ogre, I manually re-do all project for the dependencies and ogre itself,
so my partners will not get lost in CMake.
5. Resource format export tool, mesh material etc. The blender2ogre is good, but not Official. not stable.
Resources are more difficult to produce.
6. UI Library, MyGUI CEGUI recent update seems to be slowing, which makes me very worried.
Once the downstream ecosystem of the rendering engine stops, it brings the loss of users.
```

Cross-platform out of the box is very attractive.

This is my build system in a specific environment, which can be compiled directly and completely.
https://bitbucket.org/mm_longcheng/mm_lib
0. How is that urgent?
2. OGRE uses SDL2 nowadays, as OIS is indeed not a good choice.
3&4. Did you see that we provide a prebuild Java SDK of Ogre for Android: https://www.ogre3d.org/download/sdk
5. blender2ogre is official: https://github.com/OGRECave/blender2ogre Also there is OgreAssimp
6. we recently incorporated Imgui into OGRE: https://www.patreon.com/posts/important-coming-30677960
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longer
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Re: Why OGRE is Dying

Post by longer » Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:42 pm

Sorry, my bad English.

I work for ogre for mobile platform need support windows android ios.The windows use GLES2 for development and debugging.

I use ogre 1.x because i need mobile platform,I can't upgrade to 2.x.

I see the sdk but not use it.I can not commit a sdk to a repository.When i use the cmake generate a project.Tt is look confusion, especially the windows project use absolute path.This brings inconvenience to my partner.When i fix this,i create a new compile system unconsciously.

I don't use SDL as a cross-platform input. It is too heavy. A lightweight input and output is actually a local api.Android IOS touch event,Accelerator temperature, etc.

I didn't notice blender2ogre is official,sorry.I thought that only the Tool in the ogre main repository is the official.

Yes, I find OgreAssimp. For a long time.The problem is that Assimp itself is difficult to integrate.blender2ogre is better.

imgui is good optional choice.

I know that most problems have solutions, but this adds to the cost of learning.

This actually depends on who the ogre will be as a user in the future.

As an experimental product? an introductory tutorial for beginners? or an engine for the enterprise.
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paroj
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Re: Why OGRE is Dying

Post by paroj » Tue Oct 29, 2019 11:27 pm

longer wrote:
Tue Oct 29, 2019 5:42 pm
This actually depends on who the ogre will be as a user in the future.

As an experimental product? an introductory tutorial for beginners? or an engine for the enterprise.
Thats actually a good question that our last user survey, does not answer appropriately. Will consider it for the next survey.
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Tobse
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Re: Why OGRE is Dying

Post by Tobse » Fri Nov 22, 2019 12:50 am

I like Ogre. What I am missing is a way to easy contribute. For example some time ago I want to edit the wiki. How? I did not find any information.
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lonewolff
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Re: Why ORGE is Dying

Post by lonewolff » Tue Nov 26, 2019 4:54 am

paroj wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:33 am
We have prebuild sdk packages Form windows, including different language bindings. So i cannot agree Here.
Where? I am only seeing SDK's for the 1.x family.

Ogre 2.x has been around since 2012 and there has never been an SDK for it to my knowledge.
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