Snakeworlds (3D snake game) - *released* on 4/3/09 (page 4)

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joshcryer
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Post by joshcryer » Thu Jan 25, 2007 12:51 am

The "steps" that the snake moves in are actually unnoticable at higher levels. Snake has always been based on "segments" more than arbitrary precision. ie, you move 5 pixels, you hit another grid point.

My main gripe is that it starts off excruciatingly slow. I mean, I was having problems playing it it was so slow, heh. But as it speeds up it gets really really fun.

I could see this being a DS game or a PS3/X360 game for $5.
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Post by pjcast » Thu Jan 25, 2007 1:17 am

I got an error when starting about a getrawinputw (or something similiar) not being found... So, I just deleted the DINPUT8.dll you had there and it worked after that... you really shouldn't distribute things like those :)

Anyway, after that, the game worked and was pretty interesting. But as mentioned, starts off really slow and takes a while to get up to speed. As a side note, I was thinking that maybe updating your OIS to make use of the WiiMote would be interesting :) (of course, than you would have to upgrade the pyOIS bindings). Good job with this neat game :D
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scriptkid
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Post by scriptkid » Thu Jan 25, 2007 12:27 pm

Thanks again for all these responses! I'll try to answer / explain them:

Movement:
I have tried three versions of moving. The first is the one as it is now. The second looks like this one, but then smoothly (like Ajare mentioned first). The latter is to be able to 'steer' in each direction, but that removed the whole idea of poles. Because that way of movement always makes full circles at each point. I should look further into the second apprauch then. However, because of the curvations (you look at the snake in perspective) it looked like the snake was moving in stead of your head.

Jumping:
Nice idea and i thought about that. But it is already in a game called "Snake Arena". I am not sure how much one can borrow in order to stay unique.

Grid:
None of the items -including snake parts- on the globe are on a grid. It is very hard to define a grid on a sphere, because you want each cell to be
of equal size. As you can see, the snake has the same size no matter where it's moving. This is done by calculating how many angles (latitude or longitude)
the head should move in order to move exactly one piece. So you could say that it is a grid, but always relative from your current position.
I used this technique to layout a true grid, but i got alignment problems. Hard to explain, but i might have some screenshots lying around...

The problem is that you can get miss-alignments with food and walls indeed...

I agree that the snake starts of rather slow, i will look at it. Or maybe start with a smaller globe, which is also possible.
It's a quote from the movie snakes on a plane (but of course samuel jackson says plane instead of sphere
Never heard of it; not sure if we need players to think that, though ;-)
I could see this being a DS game or a PS3/X360 game for $5
Great, those are just the platforms not supported by Python-Ogre ;-)
So, I just deleted the DINPUT8.dll you had there and it worked after that... you really shouldn't distribute things like those
Thanks for the heads-up. Py2exe collected it. I will remove it then.
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Post by bharling » Sun Jan 28, 2007 9:44 pm

Quote:
I could see this being a DS game or a PS3/X360 game for $5

Great, those are just the platforms not supported by Python-Ogre
not so (i think) ..

you can definitely get a software open-gl context going on PS3 (no HW acceleration), and python woks fine, and is pre-installed with ydl linux.
also, blender has been compiled and runs ok on ps3 ydl as well.

http://www.blender3d.org/forum/viewtopi ... 22c2#58703

this is of course not proper sanctioned ps3 development, but i can't see any reason why pyogre or python-ogre could not be coaxed into compiling on ps3, albeit with a horrifying framerate.
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Post by Snicholls » Wed Jan 31, 2007 1:19 pm

nice looking, i did something exactly like this years ago of course not using ogre, but snakes on a sphere.
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Post by scriptkid » Thu Feb 01, 2007 1:05 pm

@bharling: thanks for that information. But initially the main targets are Windows and Linux.

@snicholls: cool! Did you manage to reach a playable version? If you've got some nice ideas, feel free to post ;-)
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Avihay
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Post by Avihay » Tue Feb 06, 2007 3:58 am

[beginning crazy rambling]
it is so simple yet so ingenious.
it all fits!
IT ALL FITS!
the snake is but a metaphor to a rocket and the food, it's fuel.
for don't we as a race want to free ourself from this dieing planet to a fresh one?
[end of crazy rambling]

or in other words, here is a reasonable storyline:
you are a stretchable snake who try to travel from point x to point y in this cluster of planets, that all have food fungi/plants/animals growing on them, as well as the usual snake hazards.
you as a snake then must travel from world to world, by eating enough food (that you convert to, say a volatile gas called methane (aka poo gas)), and then you must reach a specific place on the planet where the normal of that planet is aimed at the next planet. you then erect yourself, and ignite the fuel inside you, and fly like a rocket to the next planet.

I haven't actually played the game, yet, but this explanation seems to cover most of, if not all, the background needed as a storyline.

it explains why you have to eat, why you grow, why the heck is there food anyway...
couldn't figure out the speed issue yet.
a cover up for different amount of food needed as planets that have a lower gravity require less fuel to escape.
a level could end when the player actually reach to the launch point, thereby allowing him to eat more food for extra bonus points (more food=more gas=faster traveling=less exposure to vacuum).
time to mention that reptilians, being cold blooded, go into a state of suspended animation, or winter sleep, when environmental conditions get cold.

you could also have multiple lunch points leading to different planets in the planet cluster, so the game doesn't have to be linear.
just change the get from x to y to recover the x,y,z from planets a,b,c, and you get a full blown adventure action game.

animating the whole planet cluster, and the takeoff, turnaround and landing could also be neat.

and I also figured the speed issue. you have a tiny leak, so the more fuel you "store" inside you, the stronger the ehm "afterburner".

If you haven't started ROFL, then I must be using the wrong spell checker.
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Post by scriptkid » Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:44 pm

Hi all,

in the first post you will find updated links to a new demo and new screenshots! :)

I am happy to tell you that i have enhanced on many of the issues posted by you, which include:
-Smooth movement, in stead of grid-wise;
-Stage depending scoring and speed system;
-Greater speed in the first stages;
-Quickstart any of the available levels (demo only);

Besides that, new features were addes:
-You now have a limited number of lives;
-Your best times and scores are saved per stage (locally);
-Score bonus depending on your length;
-All (GUI) texts are localizable;

And last but not least: this version includes non-coder art, created by Nebo. Feel free to post any comments about it!

Happy gaming again :)
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Post by Avihay » Fri Mar 16, 2007 8:06 pm

I've tried to run the demo (V2) and it wouldn't run, until I changed the plugins.cfg file to search for the OpenGl render system in "." instead of "../bin".

The game runs, but when it tries to create the sphere on the fly, by making tons of submeshes and applying the texture to them one by one, it complains about a problem in the material script and I guess it's because it searches for this name:"01_-_Default_[Wall]" instead of that:"Nebo/Wall1".
because of this and other naming problems, non of the "world" textures appear properly except for the sky.

Now, my computer is old, slow and has old GFX card. the frame rate averages on around 62 (top 140fps) according to to some logfile, but I get periodical slowdowns. I guess that's because once in a while, my computer tries to render the other spheres on full detail when they get into view.

As far as I understand, the snake moves on a "grid". if so, the placement scheme seems different for the food. I got to a point in stage 4, without hitting myself that all the food was too close to a wall, and I had to do Kamikaze on one food'n'wall to be able to continue play.

There is a problem in the input system, as sometimes it register one tap as double tap.

In the polar caps, can you make it so that if you move along a latitude, toward the pole, and try to turn left or right in the cap, you will turn to another latitude, instead of making a too short loop?

Anyone else has experienced the texturing problems I encountered? because it could just be me, and my poor computer, running WinXp for 39 days in a row and showing singes of immanent mental breakdown.

P.s. you seem to have disregarded my previous post (two posts up).
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Post by scriptkid » Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:54 pm

Hi Avihay,

sorry to read about your troubles. The "../bin" vs. "." is odd. This hasn't changed since the previous demo and i double checked whether such path changes work from a commandline..

I know about the material warnings, that is probably an export thingy. Such issues still have to be fixed.

So you don't see anything looking good except for the sky? Can you post a screenshot? Can it be a driver issue? The other spheres do not get renderer in full detail because of applied LOD-ing, but there is a performance impact when the come into view.

There still seems to be a bug with the food placement then. The snake does not move on a grid (i explained some defails some posts up).

The double-registration of turning the snake is the trade-off between an minimum- and an annoying delay of accepting input to be able to play the game at higher speeds as well. But it might need some tweaking then.

About you other post: yeah i read it but could not really come up with a reply at then. But i will try now :)

You post seems to be a funny idea to come up with the gameplay element to have the snake move from one world to another by 'farting?' ;) The non-lineair world-to-world is a nice idea as as well, of which i am thinking myself.

Thanks for the replies and i will overthink you ideas! :)
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Post by Ayudo » Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:50 am

Demo V2:

Nice Demo!
Here my suggestions:

-Blue sky & white clouds are "boring" - lets have some (p.e. red) dramatic backgrounds...

-UP or W should make the snake temporary faster (like the down-button with tetris)

-Super Mario Kart like extras:
--Walk-through-walls: when activated have 5s no collsion-detection
--Extra life (show up only for short amount of time)
--Double: adds 2 elements instead of 1

-moving "enemies" which have to be avoided also

-multiplayer ;-)

-online scores
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Post by buonnguqua » Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:38 pm

Camera in game make me dizzy :? It rotate 180 deg in 1/2 s :cry:
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Post by scriptkid » Mon Mar 19, 2007 9:38 am

Thanks for the replies.

@ayudo:
you are right about the skies, we are still working on defining some nicer settings for the game.

I'll think about the speed boost (UP or W) and the Mario Kart extra's. Indeed there should be some more types of items to eat.

I am not sure about enemies and multiplayer. The main goal is still to have the classic snake with an extra dimension (literally). There should really be added value by putting more snakes on the sphere. But maybe there is...

Maybe moving food instead of moving enemies can be nice as well? Like little animals you have to catch, such as mice for example ;)

@buonnguqua

The camera system is part of the disorientation policy ;) But seriously: it sometimes can be a bit too fast.

Bye.
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Post by Ayudo » Mon Mar 19, 2007 12:55 pm

Oh a game which puts snake in 3d dimension and is made pretty good:
Counterclockwise

Its really addictive and lots of fun!
http://www.16x16.org/games/ccw/

Maybe you can get some ideas from there also ;-)
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Post by scriptkid » Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:53 pm

Thanks for the link; i'll give that game a try! :)
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Post by Prezadent » Mon Mar 19, 2007 4:11 pm

---------------------------
snake.exe - Unable To Locate Component
---------------------------
This application has failed to start because MSVCP71.dll was not found. Re-installing the application may fix this problem.
---------------------------
OK
---------------------------
:roll:
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Post by Ayudo » Mon Mar 19, 2007 4:24 pm

Prezadent: You need to install the .NET framework You can download it from ms.
Or you just get the dlls from dll-download sites.
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scriptkid
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Post by scriptkid » Mon Mar 19, 2007 4:36 pm

Prezadent, please try to download the seperate file from suggested download sites. It's weird though since i was able to run the game on completely non-developer systems.. Oh well i will add the file. If it still doesn't work -no dll error but only a flashing command box- try the VC2005 runtime. Links can be found in the first post in this thread.

Thanks for the heads up and good luck! :)
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Post by Prezadent » Mon Mar 19, 2007 4:55 pm

I have the runtime files from the first post. I reinstalled them.

msvcp71.dll is VS2003, not 2005. Might make a difference. I have .NET 2.0, not sure about 1.1

Edit - I know how to get it to work, by downloading the dll. :) I was pointing out an error.
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Post by scriptkid » Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:03 pm

Okay glad you got it to work :)
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Post by Prezadent » Tue Mar 20, 2007 6:57 pm

I played the demo. Quite impressive so far.

Here is what I would change if it were my game. In the least I hope it give you some inspiration...

Lose the snake theme. Its always going to be compared to Nibbler if you continue using it. Use a 3d model of a running kid. It will look better and the jump idea earlier will incorporate better should you decide to use it.

You could use clouds of stench or something like that for the 'tail'. Have a health meter. Each time you go through the stench, you lose a little health. The stench clouds get smaller till they disappear. The smaller the cloud the less health you lose. Garlic (and soap) comes to mind for a pickup item.

Use the sphere faces as a grid. Use a faceted sphere.

Extrude faces from the sphere for walls.

Extrude the pole caps, don't let the character cross them. Effectively remove them from use.

What I envision is a cross between Nibbler and Mario.

HTH,
Prez
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Post by Aladrin » Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:19 pm

I personally love the comparison to nibble(r) and would hate to see that lost. It's a classic, and this is an interesting extension of it.

Except for the 'mario' bit, I think I agree with everything else Prezadent says. ;)
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Post by scriptkid » Thu Mar 22, 2007 9:27 am

@ayudo: i have played the Counterclockwise game, which was pretty cool to do. The fact that you always keep growing makes the difficulty very lineair until you suddenly can't keep up anymore ;)

@Prezadent: thanks for enjoying what you have played so far! About your suggestion: i almost get the idea, but i don't think that the comparisation to nibbles is too bad. I mean there are many casual games who borrow -or progress on- other games, isn't it? So i share my opinion with Aladrin on this.
I like the idea of a running kid though and soap-clouds though.

What dou you mean by 'faceted sphere'. You mean the 3D term 'face'? So that you don't get seperate walls but rather a deformed sphere, right?

Why would you not use the poles? Difficulty reasons or something?

Thanks in advance for replies!
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Prezadent
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Post by Prezadent » Fri Mar 23, 2007 3:09 am

Remove the vertex normals from the sphere for a faceted sphere.
I'll post a more relevant image soon. This is just one borrowed from the net.
Image

This was for better visualization of the grid if implemented. And the poles just rip a grid implementation all apart.


Here is another idea. Use a geosphere. You could use right and left for the Y arms at each intersection. Or you could use something like 1-3-7-9 on the keypad for 4 choices at each intersection. Anyway, it eliminates the poles.

Image
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scriptkid
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Post by scriptkid » Mon Mar 26, 2007 11:11 am

Hi,

thanks for clearing this up. Now i understand why you would get rid on the poles: because of the grid. However a grid is always problematic when using a sphere. I already explained this a little some posts earlier. As you can see on your first image, the grids cells are different in size. So if you would place the snake parts (or clouds ;)) on this cells you either have gaps or need to scale the parts up. Both implementations would look weird.

However i do use some sort of 'virtual grid' though. Depending on the snake's direction it is moved precisely one part-size into that direction. I also do this when building walls. However while doing this you get errors which depend on how close you are to the pole. This shot shows this. When the wall goes back down, it doesn't match the position of the row below it:
Image

This isn't too bad however, because walls do not need to be closed and the player should never get too close to itself to notice ;)

The only downside -which i can think of- is placing food randomly. I could calculate a correct position based on the player's current position and direction and slightly update it when the player moves. Hope this is a bit clear ;)
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