bsp scene manager questions

jchmack · Post by **jchmack** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 8:54 am

i was looking at this:

http://www.ogre3d.org/wiki/index.php/SceneManagersFAQ

and i think that i want to use the bsp scene manager and i have a couple of questions:

1)

"Creating .bsp files is problematic as current .map to .bsp compilers are proprietary and encumber IP rights to the created .bsp files."

Does this mean that the bsp format is owned by ID? What if i make my map in quark?

2)Does the BSP scene manager offer any specific help with collision detection ? Can anyone point me to anything on colision detection in ogre because as of right now im keeping track of all the objects x,y,z and doing all colisions myself. But i really have no idea on how to make my objects detect collisions other than circle collisions.

thx in advance guys =D

Fredz · Post by **Fredz** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 12:52 pm

For 1), it's no longer the case since id Software released their tools under the GNU GPL.

See : http://www.ogre3d.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=17636

For 2), have a look at the ReferenceApplication distributed with OGRE. It does implement collision detection with a BSP map and the ODE physics engine.

[EDIT]
Wiki updated :
http://www.ogre3d.org/wiki/index.php/As ... vel_design
http://www.ogre3d.org/wiki/index.php/Sc ... ne_Manager
[/EDIT]

jchmack · Post by **jchmack** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 3:39 pm

Fredz wrote:For 1), it's no longer the case since id Software released their tools under the GNU GPL.

See : http://www.ogre3d.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=17636

For 2), have a look at the ReferenceApplication distributed with OGRE. It does implement collision detection with a BSP map and the ODE physics engine.

[EDIT]
Wiki updated :
http://www.ogre3d.org/wiki/index.php/As ... vel_design
http://www.ogre3d.org/wiki/index.php/Sc ... ne_Manager
[/EDIT]

thx for the help. I have a copy of quake 3 arena lying around somewhere. Do u guys have any reccomendations on what tool to use to make my lvls? And about the collision detection..... I cant get the reference application to run or build a .exe. But thx alot for clearing up the IP issues.

Post by **jacmoe** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 3:45 pm

jchmack wrote:Do u guys have any reccomendations on what tool to use to make my lvls?

If you want total freedom, then I suggest that you use a bsp importer script to get the level into Blender.
Then you can export it to OGRE.

jchmack wrote:I cant get the reference application to run or build a .exe. But thx alot for clearing up the IP issues.

Are you using the SDK? Try the source.

Anyway, if you choose to go the Blender route - after making your level in the Quake3 editor - then you can pick and choose amongst the various OGRE physics wrappers.

If you insist on using the BSP SceneManager, I can provide some links (which requires you to modify and recompile the BSP SceneManager source), but I strongly suggest that you consider going the other route.

Post by **jacmoe** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 3:48 pm

This is the link to the working Blender bsp importer:
http://www.ogre3d.org/phpBB2/viewtopic. ... b%2A#78470

jchmack · Post by **jchmack** » Sat Apr 15, 2006 8:01 pm

If you want total freedom, then I suggest that you use a bsp importer script to get the level into Blender.
Then you can export it to OGRE.

what is wrong with the BSP SceneManager? What freedom do i lose?

and

how would i go about doing this?

Fredz · Post by **Fredz** » Sun Apr 16, 2006 2:54 am

jchmack wrote:what is wrong with the BSP SceneManager? What freedom do i lose?

Cons :
- you can't do free-form scene construction with BSP level editors, you are forced to use brushes
- the BSP scene manager hasn't been updated for several years, and OGRE developers have no intent to update it anymore (patches may be accepted though)
- BSP scenes are no longer the optimal choice on current hardware (but still used in Doom 3 or Half-Life 2 though)
- BSP are intended for indoor scenes, octree are better suited for outdoor scenes

Pros :
- the BSP scene manager is the only scene manager available in stock OGRE (ie. not as an add-on) which does support a standardized file format for scenes (but you can create your own or use the .scene file format supported by some add-ons and 3d modelers such as Blender)
- you've got a completely free (as in beer and speech) and integrated toolchain to create levels with lightmapping (Quark/GTKRadiant + q3map2)
- there are many tutorials and examples about BSP levels on the Web

Post by **jacmoe** » Sun Apr 16, 2006 2:59 am

IF you choose to import the resulting bsp into Blender and then from there out to OGRE, you'll get the best of all worlds.

jchmack · Post by **jchmack** » Mon Apr 17, 2006 10:47 am

jacmoe wrote:IF you choose to import the resulting bsp into Blender and then from there out to OGRE, you'll get the best of all worlds.

do you know about importing into 3ds max? My friend is going to let me borrow his copy and im going to try to lean that. Or do i have to download blender and then use that to convert the bsp into something 3ds max can read.

Post by **jacmoe** » Mon Apr 17, 2006 3:27 pm

I have used Nem's Tools to export the HL map/bsp to either xsi or 3ds.
Had to use PolyTrans to get the 3ds into MAX. All models were in world coordinates, so you have to set them up in MAX after importing.

Maybe you are better off using Blender to load the stuff, and then export it to a format MAX likes?