DirectX 10 for Windows XP
- DaCracker
- Gremlin
- Posts: 192
- Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2005 9:57 am
- Location: Sweden
- Contact:
DirectX 10 for Windows XP
Yay!
It seems like there are some guys who are working
on porting DirectX 10 to Windows XP (and probably older
versions of Windows as well). There's already a preview
avaliable.
I find this project really exciting since I'm a happy user
of Windows XP and the only reason to why I should even
think of upgrading is for playing the new fancy games. And
now I probably won't have to
Link:
http://alkyproject.blogspot.com/2007/04 ... log-i.html
It seems like there are some guys who are working
on porting DirectX 10 to Windows XP (and probably older
versions of Windows as well). There's already a preview
avaliable.
I find this project really exciting since I'm a happy user
of Windows XP and the only reason to why I should even
think of upgrading is for playing the new fancy games. And
now I probably won't have to
Link:
http://alkyproject.blogspot.com/2007/04 ... log-i.html
----------------------------------------------------
DaCracker's Common Lib:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/dacrackerslib/
DaCracker's Common Lib:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/dacrackerslib/
- Aladrin
- Orc
- Posts: 465
- Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2006 10:22 pm
I have paid the $50 and I'm in their 'sapling' program. Unfortunately, I signed up when I thought they were focusing on Linux. Now, I don't know if they are going to do the Linux thing at all.
I've tried the Prey demo thing they provide to saplings and the sound doesn't work and it crashes after the menu. I've talked to them about it, but they 'can't reproduce the bug' and that's about it. You'd think they'd be a little more concerned about making sure the first saplings were happy with the demo. There are only 15 registered users on the forum there, about a third of which are part of the company, and I know of only 1 other registered sapling.
They aren't off to a great start.
Their plan to make a converter to make DX10 games run on DX9 is probably a LOT easier than making DX-anything run on Linux natively. (They aren't using Wine.)
They have not answered my query as to whether they plan to make DX10 work on Linux or not.
I've tried the Prey demo thing they provide to saplings and the sound doesn't work and it crashes after the menu. I've talked to them about it, but they 'can't reproduce the bug' and that's about it. You'd think they'd be a little more concerned about making sure the first saplings were happy with the demo. There are only 15 registered users on the forum there, about a third of which are part of the company, and I know of only 1 other registered sapling.
They aren't off to a great start.
Their plan to make a converter to make DX10 games run on DX9 is probably a LOT easier than making DX-anything run on Linux natively. (They aren't using Wine.)
They have not answered my query as to whether they plan to make DX10 work on Linux or not.
- Kojack
- OGRE Moderator
- Posts: 7157
- Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 7:35 am
- Location: Brisbane, Australia
- x 534
Umm, software emulating a geometry shader fast enough to play the "latest games"? Yeah...by compiling Geometry Shaders down to native machine code for execution where hardware isn't capable of running it. No longer will you have to upgrade your OS and video card(s) to play the latest games.
Sounds like when I tried to play floating point games (like quake) using a software floating point emulator on my 486sx, and could nearly get 0.1 fps if really really lucky.
Getting directx 10 working in xp on a directx 10 card is at least believable. But getting directx 10 working in xp on a directx 9 card fast enough for latest games is a bit unrealistic.
-
- Greenskin
- Posts: 116
- Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2006 9:35 am
- Contact:
- DaCracker
- Gremlin
- Posts: 192
- Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2005 9:57 am
- Location: Sweden
- Contact:
Well, I see that most of you think that this may not work and..
yeah... maybe it's true, but I think it's worth a try anyway. They
seem to be pretty sure that their project will succed since they
say that they'll make games and stuff with it. Anyway, I'll be
cool to see the result of this, at least according to me, intressting
project
yeah... maybe it's true, but I think it's worth a try anyway. They
seem to be pretty sure that their project will succed since they
say that they'll make games and stuff with it. Anyway, I'll be
cool to see the result of this, at least according to me, intressting
project
----------------------------------------------------
DaCracker's Common Lib:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/dacrackerslib/
DaCracker's Common Lib:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/dacrackerslib/
- PolyVox
- OGRE Contributor
- Posts: 1316
- Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 11:28 am
- Location: Groningen, The Netherlands
- x 18
- Contact:
- Praetor
- OGRE Retired Team Member
- Posts: 3335
- Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2005 8:26 pm
- Location: Rochester, New York, US
- x 3
- Contact:
This is all so outrageous. I don't see them getting anywhere, because as soon as they have a "success" microsoft will shut them down. But, maybe it will at least let MS know people are willing to do almost anything not to upgrade. I mean, I have the features sitting on my card, don't blab to me about driver models, just let me get access to those hardware features!
-
- Halfling
- Posts: 90
- Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2007 5:50 pm
Not entirely so, with multicore CPUs the geometry shader (which, handling geometry, will probably not have that much troughput to deal with) can run on an unused core.Professor420 wrote:Sorry but I have to totally disagree.Kojack wrote:Getting directx 10 working in xp on a directx 10 card is at least believable. But getting directx 10 working in xp on a directx 9 card fast enough for latest games is a bit unrealistic.
Its not a bit realistic. Its totally fucking ridiculous.
But I think it will have compatibility problems (see wine).
- sinbad
- OGRE Retired Team Member
- Posts: 19269
- Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2002 11:19 pm
- Location: Guernsey, Channel Islands
- x 66
- Contact:
If you want Dx10 features on XP, just wait for the features to trickle down via GL, it's already starting (although only nVidia seems to be bothering with this, which isn't surprising I suppose since ATI have never been particularly interested in GL). Don't hold your breath for the major games to support it for a little while though.
- jacmoe
- OGRE Retired Moderator
- Posts: 20570
- Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 10:13 am
- Location: Denmark
- x 179
- Contact:
Is it?Professor420 wrote:Sorry but I have to totally disagree.Kojack wrote:Getting directx 10 working in xp on a directx 10 card is at least believable. But getting directx 10 working in xp on a directx 9 card fast enough for latest games is a bit unrealistic.
Its not a bit realistic. Its totally fucking ridiculous.
I don't think so.
If you buy a DX10 card now, you are forced to upgrade to Vista, aren't you?
That you can call f"#¤&g ridiculous, if you absolutely must.
/* Less noise. More signal. */
Ogitor Scenebuilder - powered by Ogre, presented by Qt, fueled by Passion.
OgreAddons - the Ogre code suppository.
Ogitor Scenebuilder - powered by Ogre, presented by Qt, fueled by Passion.
OgreAddons - the Ogre code suppository.
- DaCracker
- Gremlin
- Posts: 192
- Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2005 9:57 am
- Location: Sweden
- Contact:
Yeah, I know that the new stuff will be avaliable in OpenGL, however...sinbad wrote:
If you want Dx10 features on XP, just wait for the features to trickle down via GL, it's already starting (although only nVidia seems to be bothering with this, which isn't surprising I suppose since ATI have never been particularly interested in GL). Don't hold your breath for the major games to support it for a little while though.
I have a ATI card so it may take a while before I can get my hands on
it
Well said!jacmoe wrote:Is it?Professor420 wrote:Sorry but I have to totally disagree.Kojack wrote:Getting directx 10 working in xp on a directx 10 card is at least believable. But getting directx 10 working in xp on a directx 9 card fast enough for latest games is a bit unrealistic.
Its not a bit realistic. Its totally fucking ridiculous.
I don't think so.
If you buy a DX10 card now, you are forced to upgrade to Vista, aren't you?
That you can call f"#¤&g ridiculous, if you absolutely must.
----------------------------------------------------
DaCracker's Common Lib:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/dacrackerslib/
DaCracker's Common Lib:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/dacrackerslib/
- xavier
- OGRE Retired Moderator
- Posts: 9481
- Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 2:03 am
- Location: Dublin, CA, US
- x 22
???jacmoe wrote: If you buy a DX10 card now, you are forced to upgrade to Vista, aren't you?
http://www.nvidia.com/page/geforce8.htmlFull support for both Microsoft® DirectX 10 and DirectX 9 for unparalleled levels of graphics realism and performance
I am guessing that under the covers, the drivers implement the little bit of shader functionality needed to fill in the gaps left by the missing fixed-function pipeline in DX9 on these cards.
I mean, think about what you said for a second: would nVidia really pull an Intel here (speaking of the Itanium desktop debacle, where they nearly got owned by AMD who had x86-64 chips where the Itanium was IA64 only) and produce a graphics card that at its release, only a very tiny tiny fraction of its target market could use?
- jacmoe
- OGRE Retired Moderator
- Posts: 20570
- Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 10:13 am
- Location: Denmark
- x 179
- Contact:
Gimme a break, xavier!xavier wrote:???jacmoe wrote: If you buy a DX10 card now, you are forced to upgrade to Vista, aren't you?
I thought that DirectX 10 was only available on Vista?
I know you can use DX9 with a DX10 card, but that's not what I'd buy such a card for.
Besides, you can get a very beefy DX9 card for a lot less money nowadays.
I am just against being forced to buy an OS upgrade to be able to use the latest DX10 features, that's all.
Allow me to link to my favorite Vista review:
Why Vista Won't Suck
/* Less noise. More signal. */
Ogitor Scenebuilder - powered by Ogre, presented by Qt, fueled by Passion.
OgreAddons - the Ogre code suppository.
Ogitor Scenebuilder - powered by Ogre, presented by Qt, fueled by Passion.
OgreAddons - the Ogre code suppository.
- jacmoe
- OGRE Retired Moderator
- Posts: 20570
- Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 10:13 am
- Location: Denmark
- x 179
- Contact:
I agree with you here.xavier wrote:I am guessing that under the covers, ...
Let's see how much X there is in DX10.
/* Less noise. More signal. */
Ogitor Scenebuilder - powered by Ogre, presented by Qt, fueled by Passion.
OgreAddons - the Ogre code suppository.
Ogitor Scenebuilder - powered by Ogre, presented by Qt, fueled by Passion.
OgreAddons - the Ogre code suppository.
- Kencho
- OGRE Retired Moderator
- Posts: 4011
- Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 6:28 pm
- Location: Burgos, Spain
- x 2
- Contact:
- jacmoe
- OGRE Retired Moderator
- Posts: 20570
- Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 10:13 am
- Location: Denmark
- x 179
- Contact:
AFAIK, Vista uses DirectX9 to render the desktop.Kencho wrote:Rather the opposite: If you upgrade to Vista, you're forced to buy a DX10 cardjacmoe wrote:If you buy a DX10 card now, you are forced to upgrade to Vista, aren't you?
My machine has a Windows Experience Index (sic) of 4.4 - using an ATI Radeon X1650 - not bad.
/* Less noise. More signal. */
Ogitor Scenebuilder - powered by Ogre, presented by Qt, fueled by Passion.
OgreAddons - the Ogre code suppository.
Ogitor Scenebuilder - powered by Ogre, presented by Qt, fueled by Passion.
OgreAddons - the Ogre code suppository.
- Mikachu
- Gnoll
- Posts: 603
- Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2005 4:11 pm
- Location: Nice, France
- x 35
Well, that's for theory.jacmoe wrote: Allow me to link to my favorite Vista review:
Why Vista Won't Suck
In practice, having tested Vista with my 4.1 experience PC, it has a very nice UI, but is slower than XP for running games, and has even worse drivers than linux (video and audio).
OgreProcedural - Procedural Geometry for Ogre3D
- Kencho
- OGRE Retired Moderator
- Posts: 4011
- Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 6:28 pm
- Location: Burgos, Spain
- x 2
- Contact:
-
- Greenskin
- Posts: 116
- Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2006 9:35 am
- Contact:
Forget about just the geometry shader. A (comparitively simple) shader like Parallax Occlusion slows a moderate computer down to 30-40 FPS in a solitary scene, with nothing else going on. You will simply not be able to run DX10 games on DX9 hardware, taking into account nothing other than graphics. Until, perhaps, we get to the point where CPU power is enough that today's GPU's can be emulated easily, in, say, a decade or so.barkas wrote:Not entirely so, with multicore CPUs the geometry shader (which, handling geometry, will probably not have that much troughput to deal with) can run on an unused core.Professor420 wrote:Sorry but I have to totally disagree.Kojack wrote:Getting directx 10 working in xp on a directx 10 card is at least believable. But getting directx 10 working in xp on a directx 9 card fast enough for latest games is a bit unrealistic.
Its not a bit realistic. Its totally fucking ridiculous.
But I think it will have compatibility problems (see wine).
The fastest DX9 card is simply not fast enough to keep up with DX10 graphics and shaders... I would assume.
- irrdev
- Orc
- Posts: 420
- Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 7:30 pm
- Contact:
I think that these guys should stop trying to make a new implementation of DX10, but rather just route the calls to DX9 functions. If a feature isn't supported by DX9, then it should simply be "null." Of course, this wouldn't work for all games, but it would be fine for the majority. GL of course would work almost as well.
FeedLaunch .NET RSS and ATOM feed editor- open-source and released under the GPL. Visit Feed Launch .NET Project Website hosted at sourceforge.net
- Kojack
- OGRE Moderator
- Posts: 7157
- Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 7:35 am
- Location: Brisbane, Australia
- x 534
Umm, how many DX10 games won't use a single feature of DX10? If people don't want DX10 features in their game they would use DX9 so it will work on both XP and Vista. Most of the new features aren't exactly things you can just null out without the game being affected.If a feature isn't supported by DX9, then it should simply be "null." Of course, this wouldn't work for all games, but it would be fine for the majority.
- Kencho
- OGRE Retired Moderator
- Posts: 4011
- Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 6:28 pm
- Location: Burgos, Spain
- x 2
- Contact:
I wonder how many studios Microsoft will pay so that they release their games under Dx10 only, even if they don't use any particular features. We've seen this in the past with Windows systems, so that wouldn't be anything new.Kojack wrote:Umm, how many DX10 games won't use a single feature of DX10? If people don't want DX10 features in their game they would use DX9 so it will work on both XP and Vista. Most of the new features aren't exactly things you can just null out without the game being affected.If a feature isn't supported by DX9, then it should simply be "null." Of course, this wouldn't work for all games, but it would be fine for the majority.
- sinbad
- OGRE Retired Team Member
- Posts: 19269
- Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2002 11:19 pm
- Location: Guernsey, Channel Islands
- x 66
- Contact: