Ogre to tap into FX composer 2

[Jerky]

I have a lot of neat demos for it done by me and four students they have done there parts as there final year exam at my company.

So, in other words, you are getting work done for you for free, to your benefit, but also trying to make money off of it. Lee04, don't try and fool people here, we are much too smart to not see through it. We know your angle is always about what gets you money. Thats fine. But don't expect people to help you with anything, especially if you are not willing to do it yourself. Lots of talk and no show. Keep digging (yourself into a deeper hole), this is just starting to get good.

[Kojack]

Back to the topic at hand...

It would be cool if there was an sdk for Mental Mill, but there doesn't seem to be one, at least for the cut down limited version nvidia are giving away. The full version has shader code editing, single stepping through shaders, and displaying shader variables directly on the preview model with automatic or user specified remapping to a colour range.

[HexiDave]

Back to the topic at hand...

Shhh! I like where this thread is going *grabs popcorn*.

FX Composer 2 + Drama = Good thread.

Please don't ban me...

[Falagard]

Shhh! I like where this thread is going *grabs popcorn*.

[Lee04]

It would be cool if there was an sdk for Mental Mill, but there doesn't seem to be one, at least for the cut down limited version nvidia are giving away. The full version has shader code editing, single stepping through shaders, and displaying shader variables directly on the preview model with automatic or user specified remapping to a colour range.

Goodwork! You get the idea...

Lobbing for more is allways a good thing.

I have a lot of neat demos for it done by me and four students they have done there parts as there final year exam at my company.

So, in other words, you are getting work done for you for free, to your benefit, but also trying to make money off of it. Lee04, don't try and fool people here, we are much too smart to not see through it. We know your angle is always about what gets you money. Thats fine. But don't expect people to help you with anything, especially if you are not willing to do it yourself. Lots of talk and no show. Keep digging (yourself into a deeper hole), this is just starting to get good.

Well you dig a hole as well, because all these students got top jobs at game companies directly afterwards when they came to me they had offer the same companies do do there exam work with them.

Even if they showed very good demos they where refused.
They wanted to do a game or computer graphics exam work.
They have no idea of what to do, I give them the idea, all the research done in the area, I teach them about GPU programming and show them how the work could be implemented on the GPU.


These exam things is a mutual benefactory it's a win/win situation.

And no I don't make money of it it's risky and difficult research areas.
That I wouldn't put any of my cash into.

I even invited you to make this project LGPL, right?
How often do you get such an inviation?

They get a job even if the project fails because it's on a height of research that proves they can tackle some real problems.

Half the students that are called drops out before they start because they realise it's tuff.

Those how have proceeded all made it with great projects and top jobs in the industry

I don't force the students to use any particular API's they choose some used OpenGl some DirectX. I said I prefer if they would use Ogre but no one wanted so far.

And I say I am not interested to make money on this I invited you to make it LGPL. It has cost me a lot to take on these students in time and money, so much so that game companies don't take on students for exam jobs.

How far did you drop in your hole know?

I say I think there is many here that are looking for ideas for projects to do.

I have a bunch of ideas. Is it so bad to share these?

For instance I would like to se a OgreCuda API as an add-on to Ogre...

(Hops I can't help myself)

D¤%e it! maybe some one picked this up right know and started working on it....

Do you think Bill Gates and his wife is giving away all their money for nothing, just because they are so kind? I don't think so. They give money but gets more power and influence and respect.

And there is always a chance they get someone else’s money as well to give a way. Actually this happened already so the couple doubled there fortune so to say they can know give away twice as much.... Not a bad investment for there fond.

The proof for HOQ is there.. Way back in showcase forum maybe 2005?

And I showed Sinbad the stuff in person way back I think ity was at ECTS in London or some simular event.

ATI's driver developers used the OpenGl scene manager app mixing different scene mangers to do effcient seamless indoor / out door handling with HOQ. ATI usied it to develop their support for NVidias GL extension for HOQ... And that was before I did the Ogre renderingh plug-in...

Students has only been with me sense the summer 2005.
And the idea I got from two different friends that started there companies with students.

They both are going great many of the students have jobs with them or elsewhere. You may have hered about MP3 Pro....
the new file format for a more efficent MP3.

Jerky wrote:

We know your angle is always about what gets you money. Thats fine. But don't expect people to help you with anything, especially if you are not willing to do it yourself.

Maybe just maybe you mixing me up with all these duds that come in here and don't have anything to offer in return?

Usually LGPL is created when one or two people drop what they done to LGPL. Because they want it maintained or whatever. Maybe to make money of it because you can even if it'äs LGPL:ed.

Maybe people will just take it and use it no value added.

If I want to make something LGPL I want to do it by agreement.
We developed all this you developed something as well for it for certain.
Then it will be LGPL:ed not before...

I whish I had done something like that with the lowlevel HOQ API.

I just donated it to Ogre hoping or presuming that serius graphics pros would integrate it tightly to the Ogres rendering, that LGPL would stand out ass a very good way to work together..... Which never happened.

That’s why I finally did my own HOQ rendering plug-in. So it wouldn't have to be LGPL it because I was disappointed in how LGPL and on peoples general interest for new graphics APIs usage.

I believe hardware instancing is not either knitted into Ogres rendering yet.

So I think I proved that I:

1. Tried to work with LGPL.
2. Willing to develop new LGPL projects.
3. Proved myself to do my own work when LGPL didn't work.
4. Being a great person giving away code and letting people have my ideas and execute there own projects with my help.
5. Team size and brains matters, help students and they will help you.

Let's face it many people good programmers are good analytic people but holistic ideas and holistic relationships in technology and usablitlity are not for analytical people to come up with so easily. It do happen sometimes.






.

[jacmoe]

Please, show us some of the cool things you've made with Ogre!

[sinbad]

Whatever the various opinions are, let's try to keep this discussion away from being personal, everyone. It's still fairly jovial ribbing but let's not let it get out of hand. No-one has to justify themselves in this forum, if you feel they're asking too much then just keep on walking.

Personally I've been meaning to dig into FxComposer 2 for months - nvidia encouraged me to play with a beta a while back and I'm ashamed I didn't find much time to do it. There are always a million things to be doing it seems. I'm quite interested in what people feel about Mental Mill since it seems a quite good idea - squaring the circle of real-time and offline shader / materials has always been pretty hard and I'd like to know how well it's turned out.

[Evak]

I Played with Mental Mill a little after using shaderFX. Unfortunately the first shader I tried to make was not possible because there does not appear to be any support in mental mill for vertex colors or alpha. And have been using vertex colors to blend between several normal map textures for my scenery.

I brought this up in their forums and never got any response, I'm assuming there isn't any support for vertex colors. So overall was disappointed. If your using 3dsmax and have some money to spare I'd highly recommend ShaderFX. But since Mental Mill is free you can't really go wrong.

Mental Mills shaders seem (as an artist) harder to follow. Also I couldn't find any preferences for setting the shader model you want to export in, from what I can tell, even a simple bump map shader comes out as a SM.3.0 shader.

Mental mill exports to CG HLSL and GLSL whilst shaderFX like most shader authoring tools only exports to .FX

Which is why I personaly would favor a FX composer > Ogre exporter.

[Lee04]

Personaly I feel my HOQ work etc would have been totally LGPL from start if there wasn't "that" kind of attitude in the first place....

"You are just tricking people to do things etc."

I don't have to trick anyone.

Belive it or not the way we used to work together with LGPL is changing
all but slowly.

More parts are semi commersial tools like FX Composer etc.

Why should we help NVidia develop something for there tool?

Well it can be darn usefull for one. It's fun and a learning experiance and a good portfolio peice. You get to know people and new stuff.

Maybe just maybe you land a job at NVidia....